Rufuskins' Workshop LYR Wagons

I have now restarted my efforts with Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway (LYR) wagons and here is my first revised effort for 9 ft wheelbase wagons:-

I have been steadily producing standard parts that can be used throughout my interpretation of the LYR wagon fleet, which is another way of describing my compromise based approach. I will be generating a series of Common Loads that are specific to these wagons in order to take account of variation in width and length compared to the excellent Common Loads produced by Ian.

Looking good Alec!

Amazing how when you create something you can copy it into another model! Except with TSM you have to already have a model in place before you can paste a part into the model.....Then you have to open and close it... Just wish TSM was a bit more user friendly!

Cheers

Andy

Very nice work,Alec - a super model!

Thank you for your kind comments and always appreciated.

. . . . and for the next LYR wagon out of the workshop, we have a Diagram 4 Coal or Loco Coal Wagon. To make me feel at home I have run it behind an LYR Class 27 on a test outing through Rochdale!

Mind you I have done my best to mess it up by missing several parts but not all at the same time - I've exported it three times!

. . and another one rolls off the production line, namely a Diagram 5 Loco Coal Wagon.

These days I always miss something, and in this case it's the tie bars between the bogies on the Diagram 005. I've now added them but no upload picture available. I have now started on a Diagram 006 - it was this that triggered the above error alert! Hopefully will finish that this evening.

Well got there eventually, and so here's diagram 6

Here's LYR Diagram 3 Covered Goods Wagon:-

I still have to run it through Polymaster, add "L" and "Y" to the body texture, adjust the roof cover width and check/amend bounding box values!

. . . and so it goes on with the next one as follows:-

Here's a copy of my spread sheet that I use to progress this project:-

Here's the next one.

. . . and still they come! This time it's the Diagram 16 Half Box in 3, 4 and 5 plank versions.

Currently working on the Diagram 17 Cattle Wagon, and is taking a little longer as I need to develop more parts including one which requires an alpha channel. Here's a screenshot of the framing:-

The end requires solid planking. The top third of the sides is open. The middle third is solid planking. The lower third has a series of vertical struts with gaps to allow any deleterious material to drain out! The central area comprises a pair of doors that open outwards with a bottom section that folds down to form the ramp. Again some degree of compromise will be adopted but the end result should be representative of the wagon!

Here's the Diagram 17 Cattle Wagon - not quite complete as it needs some tidying up.

I've tidied up the Diagram 17 Cattle Wagon, added a two plank variant of the Diagram 16 Half Box Wagon and just completed a two plank unfitted Diagram 13 Fish Wagon - see below:-

Here's an unusual wagon:-

. . . . and still they keep coming!

I've already moved onto the next 9ft wheelbase wagon, which is a tank wagon for Gas Reservoirs for use with Fleetwood buoys. Below is my latest effort for the tank itself. Needs some lifting hooks on the top and some guestimated valves, etc. - no details available for this particular wagon (only 3 produced).

Here's my best "guess" for the LYR Diagram 30!

Yes it's me again with another LYR 9 ft wheelbase wagon!

Great looking models Alec! Especially like the Meat Van! Great job!

Thank you for the positive comment. I have another 11 LYR wagons with a 9 ft wheelbase to do! I have two on the stocks at the moment, but that's the last bit of work for tonight as I'll be watching the England-Australia rugby union match in a short while. Here's hoping that they can do the business!

I guess the less said about the rugby match last Saturday the better!

Anyway I've pushed on with the wagons and have now produced models of the Diagram 52 Half Box and the Diagram 53 Ballast. I shall be moving onto the Diagram 60 Gunpowder Van, which was essentially a GWR "Iron Mink" on an LYR chassis! After that there will be seven LYR Diagrams on a 9 foot wheel base, of which four have vacuum brakes and one is the Diagram 20 Brake Van. At that time there be 31 different wagon models available for download - almost certainly in the new TSSH upload area?

This next wagon caused the occasional explosion of "strong language", but hopefully it's now something like!

Started on Diagram 66 Covered Goods. which was an attempt to adapt the standard Diagram 3 with the use of outside framing - Covered Goods was the description used by the Lancashire and Yorkshire for Vans.

I've also started creating a presentation using LibreOffice's Impress Presentation showing the wagons currently being created, and I might take the wife's ex-laptop once it's being revived to show at the LYR AGM in several weeks time? Obviously I'll need to convince myself that my efforts won't be unacceptable to those in the know? The idea being to show people that it isn't always necessary to use the traditional model railway approach to keep the LYR alive, and that train simulation is an acceptable approach - even it meant using the other sim! I suppose the same idea could be adopted for the LNWR coaches? Mind you I'll need to get a better grip on the use of the this software!

Alec, are we going to be able to run some of them soon and offer our comments?

David
When I've finished the current batch of 9 ft wheelbase wagons, and created common loads where necessary I will be looking to do a single upload - possibly via the TSSH area. There are seven left to do. Then I'll either go back to LNWR coaches or move onto 10 ft wheelbase LYR wagons?

Here's a few notes on this area of the workshop.
1. The latest wagon (Diagram 66) has proved a little more difficult - perhaps that should read I made it a little more difficult - than I thought, but I seem to have sorted it out now. I've just finished the door fittings; i.e. hinges, etc., and now need to address the other fittings to the sides and ends.
2. I've also started to look at the 4 plank Fish Wagon which had vacuum braking, and I've put together some sketches with dimensions to be be able to create a reasonable representation of the brakes, although any one looking for a finely detailed model will be disappointed!
3. With respect to the presentation for the LYR wagons, the LibreOffice's "Impress" is more than OK, and I am able to use what little skills I developed with MS Office to good use.
4. I shall use the LYR AGM to sort out some details for a typical LYR Container for use with the Diagram 14 wagon, and to confirm LYR's method of transporting fish in open wagons. This would then allow me to develop more of my own Common Loads for use with the LYR wagons; necessary as the typical ones don't quite fit mine. I'll need to investigate the range of merchandise carried, although coal was probably the most important. Mind you this was mainly carried in PO wagons, and hence I may need to develop some from the "Ince Wagon" book by Watts.

It's worth noting that the aim is to create as many of the LYR wagons as illustrated in the the two volumes of Noel Coates' "Lancashire & Yorkshire Wagons". If I can continue to build up suitable references I would also like to create a range of LYR carriages, but that is not proving particularly easy. Apparently a book is in preparation by the LYR Society but it is not clear where this is currently at - another question for the AGM!

When you take into account the LNWR carriage area of the workshop as well as the SR (Bulleid) and GWR (Hawksworth) carriage area I don't see how I'll ever be without some item of stock to model. Of course I also want to do some LNWR engines, and I also have references for the Highland Railway and Southern Railway as well as Midland Railway wagons and coaches . . . . . admittedly the latter are already well covered but they still present me with opportunities!

Finally we must never forget SWMBO's list!

rufuskins wrote:I will be looking to do a single upload - possibly via the TSSH area.

Seems a lot of wagons for a single upload.
Might put off an activity writer wanting to include an L&Y wagon or two in an activity for a non L&Y route.

Can I suggest you package them by type?

L&Y_Open
L&Y_Mineral
L&Y_Hopper
L&Y_Van
L&Y_Specialised_Van (Fruit, Meat, Banana etc)
L&Y_Liverstock
L&Y_Specialised_Open (Container, Fish, Bogie etc)
L&Y_Tank
L&Y_Brakevan

This would Let you release the wagons as you complete each type rather than keep us waiting.

Hi Alec,

I agree with Ian as it makes checking the source of each stock item used so much easier. When creating activities it often takes me ages to check where each item came from, particularly when one download places wagons and/or coaches in different folders.

Regards,

Stephen

I note your comments and will take them into consideration if and when I'm ready to make them available. I decided to develop the wagons by wheel base rather than wagon type hence these first ones all have a 9 ft wheel base. Admittedly this means the wagon types vary, and this is as much for my sake in order to give some variety whilst creating them. I had considered uploading the 9 ft wheel base versions as one upload, which would comprise about 30 wagons. This would then give a reasonable spread of wagon types. To date I have effectively created 23, I'm working on 1 and that leaves another 6! The other wheel bases and bogie types then comprise another 83. Anyway we'll see how things go over the next week or two.

Diagram 66 is now just about complete.

Looking very good Alec.

First attempt at a fitted wagon, which is the 4 plank Fish Wagon (Diagram 13). Not perfect but a not unreasonable representation.

Just need to finalise the WAG file for the vacuum braking - see query in General Discussion area.

Finalised the WAG files for the above using 13% of mass as MaxBrakeForce! Shown below is another fitted wagon - although I see that the end door hinges are too low!

Door hinges re-located, and WAG files amended. I think I'll move onto the Diagram 21 Brake Van!

Hi Alec,
You're like a Carriage & Wagon Works!!

Did Horwich used to build wagons?

Well done, mate

Cheers,
Ged

slipperman12 wrote:Hi Alec,
You're like a Carriage & Wagon Works!!

Did Horwich used to build wagons?

Well done, mate

Cheers,
Ged

I'll go along with that ! Here's a good name for you "Milnrow Carriage and Wagon Works"

Once I got into the swing of making NSWGR stock years ago, I coined the name "Short North Carriage and Wagon Engineering Workshops" for my output, and this was before I started making locos.

The "Short North" is the railwayman's nickname for the Sydney to Newcastle main line.

Regards, Brian

One of my problems is that once I do get "hooked" on something I can become a bit obsessive as was indicated when I set out on the FG DMU repaint project. Admittedly my obsession doesn't require exact/precise representations.
When I decided to try my hand at virtual modeling I decided that I wanted to create items that weren't commonly available in MSTS, and it was at this time that I came across some publications for wagons on the Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway. It of course operated services in the Milnrow and Rochdale areas and hence it was obvious where I should start. I'm more than happy to retain the current workshop title, besides which the shock to Rufus at his time of life . . . .
However I also wanted to build carriages, but here the information for LYR was relatively scarce. I therefore tried Southern coaches and then Hawksworth but finally decided on the LNWR where there was a plethora of books and references on their coaches. It also seemed relevant as the two companies merged in 1922 before the creation of the LMS, etc.
The LYR initially built their wagons and carriages at Miles Platting until 1873 when the works caught fire. As can be imagined it caused chaos and outside contractors were used until the new works was constructed at Newton Heath. This continued to be used until 1930 when the last new wagon was built, and it was finally closed in 1932. Apparently some chap named H. N. Gresley worked there as Assistant Carriage and Wagon Superintendent between 1904 and 1905 before moving onto the Great Northern Railway, and the rest as they say is history.

As an aside I've tried to use my first attempt at making the Diagram 21 Brake van but found there were several dimensional errors and therefore I'm going to rebuild the main body from scratch.

Here's the current version of the Diagram 21 Brake Van, which requires some changes comprising end handrail adjustment, L and Y on side panels and adjust the window to the internal partition.

Also need to amend the textures to the Running Boards.

The Diagram 21 has been amended and the next wagon completed - namely a Diagram 32A single bolster.

They are looking good Alec.

We are going to be spoiled for choice when these are done

Thanks for the kind words. I now have three more wagons to do in the 9 ft wheelbase set, although it has been suggested that I upload them in a different format. However before I get to that stage I need to prepare a series of common loads to fit these particular wagon sizes, using a Common.Loads_LYR folder. I'll be attending the LYR Society AGM in Ramsbottom next Saturday, when I hope to get clarification on some of the loads and loading methods.

After a pleasant day out visiting Knott End and Fleetwood, I returned to my latest LYR wagon. I am currently finalising a Diagram 39 Refrigerator Van - just need to add the door fittings. That will leave me just the Diagram 64 Butter Van in the 9 foot wheelbase wagons, I could include the Diagram 41 which was used for the carriage of boilers and comprised 3 pairs of single bolsters close coupled together, but on reflection I might move this into the miscellaneous section? In addition they were only used in this manner between 1901 and 1909 before reverting back to single bolsters.

. . . . and here's my best effort for the Diagram 39 Refrigerated Van.



Looking at it, the body colour perhaps needs to be a bit more "whiter"!

Here's the last of the 9 ft wheel base wagons, namely the Diagram 64 Butter Van.

It may need the odd tweak here and there but that now means there is a total of 33 wagons in this particular folder, No decision yet on the method of upload until I have completed the LYR Common Load folder, other than they will be put in the TSSH upload area!

Alec, I am really looking forward to seeing these.

What a splendid set of wagons. These are most interesting and very nicely done. Roderic

I challenge you to do the boiler wagon loaded.

I have failed to figure out how to build a set of three single bolsters coupled together with a load spread over all three wagons.

I think it's impossible.
(I say that in the hope I'll be proved wrong.)