3d cabs on TSSH download page

Hi All,

I am starting to upload my 3d cabs to the TSSH download page. Justin has kindly set a folder up for me on there.
I have uploaded my Class 37 3d cab for starters.

Could someone please do me a favour and try the download out to see if I have uploaded it correctly? The link should take you to my Dropbox storage. Let me know if it works easily.

Geoff

Hi Geoff,
Downloaded with no problem
Although I've not tested it, there is one Night folder containing 26 files and 53 files in the main folder.

Cheers,
Ged

Hi Ged,

Thanks for checking, that seems about right.

geoff

As the Class 37 upload seems to be successful, I have added the class 47 3d cab, and the Brush Falcon model. The latter model is an update, with permission of Chris Bailly's model. I have repainted the loco to better represent the actual colour, and added a 3d cab. The activity for Thames Trent is also included.

Please let me know if there are any issues with the downloading or the models, and I will respond. I am currently working on other 3d cabs, and will add them later on.

Installed the Brush Type 4, 3d cab today and very nice it is thank you very much.

Got a problem with not being able to cancel the AWS warning though.

Not sure if that is associated with the new cab or OR related.

Mike.

I haven't tried that cab out for a while, and OR has changed. I'll check it out.

Geoff

Hi Mike

Thanks for pointing this out. Having checked this version, I see that it is not the latest one. I made some updates earlier this year, and included the AWS instructions. I will upload the later version. It is available on UKTS if you cannot wait.

Cheers,
Geoff

Hi Geoff,

i downloaded both the 3d Class 47 & Class 37 cabs from ukts yesterday.

Installed the Class 37 3d cab late last night and it is excellent thank you.

When i resumed the activity using the 47 cab, the aws warning had stopped sounding.

One small thing and i am not sure if it is an OR problem.

When changing cabs in the 37 3d cabview, the driver figure stays in the original cab.

https://i.ibb.co/Wxtt68g/Open-Rails-2021-10-21-09-47-15.png

https://i.ibb.co/tZW7qfg/Open-Rails-2021-10-21-09-48-27.png

MEP activity starts with the original cab facing the three MK1's. Couple in the platform and then use the key command to change cabs. Drive figure remains where he is, which is now the rear cab.

Apologies if i am nit picking Geoff.

Regards,
Mike.

Hi Mike,

Glad you like the cabs. You are not nitpicking, I am happy to get some feedback, to be honest.

The driver does stay in the original cab when changing ends. That is a limitation of the feature. I added the driver using a freight animation, not as part of the cabview. this is done so that he can be animated.

I don't know what's happening with the AWS warning. It seems to work fine on the version of OR that I am using. What version are you using?

Geoff

Hiya Geoff,

it can be a fine line with some people (not this forum). Between trying to point out things or getting on the wrong side of them buddy.

Understand about the driver and it is not a big problem anyway.

I am using the latest Monogame revision 108 release Geoff.

Regards,
Mike.

Hi Mike,

I have just tried the Class 47 cab in the latest Monogame version, and the AWS sound works fine for me. Do you have the Openrails, Script and Sound folders in the engine folder? They should be all that is needed.

I have added my 3d cabs to all the Class 37 and 47 locos in my installations and find it hard to do any activities without a 3d cab these days. I am wondering what cab to do next. Last year I did a couple of steam cabs, and they work OK, but I am not keen to do another as it takes a long time. I quite fancy doing the Midland Blue Pullman, but there are only a few activities for that one.

Geoff

Apologies Geoff, i think the aws problem is my own fault.

When creating the cloned .eng file in your extra Openrails folder added to each loco.

I think i misread your instructions for the 47's. I only changed the name of each 47 on the very first line and the same name without the .eng suffix at the bottom of each eng file.

I didn't ammend the WAGON line (2nd line down). With the 37's your instructions do say to change all three lines in each .eng file.

Which i did and the aws works fine. So i went back to each 47 and changed the WAGON name to the same as the other two lines and now i have working aws in both 3d cabs.

What a joy to be able to mouse click the aws button in your 3d cabs to cancel the warning. Adds that extra level of immersion, with clickable controls.

In regards new 3d cabviews, i would personally love to see two generic cabs for DMU's.

One with a two windscreen view, as in 105's and 120's and one with a three windscreen view as per 117's etc.

But it is not for me to tell you what to do Geoff. I am more than happy with the two i have now.

I won't be able to drive 37's and 47's now with a 2d cabview.

Oh i nearly forgot another great feature of your cabs. The FOV can be changed independently of the external FOV setting, not possible in the 2d cabs as far as i know in OR.

Many thanks for all your hard work.

Regards,
Mike.

Thanks for the kind comments Mike.

I'm glad that you sorted the AWS out. The instructions are sometimes a bit hard to follow. When I was testing my own installation instructions, I missed an important step - so it's easily done!

I have now uploaded my Class 317 EMU cab to the TSSH download page, and this too includes AWS. This can be used with a good range of similar units.

I will also put my steam 3d cabs on here too in the near future.

I will think about your idea for a generic DMU cab. It may be possible to use the 317 cab model as a basis.

Cheers,

Geoff

Hi Geoff,

I have just tried downloading your 317 cab on your TSSH download page, the picture is there but it's missing the file itself.

The one at UKTS downloads ok.

Regards,

Stephen

Very welcome Geoff and anything you create will be most welcome by me.

Although Western, Warship & Hymek 3d cabs would be nice

Regards,
Mike.

StephenRWells wrote:Hi Geoff,

I have just tried downloading your 317 cab on your TSSH download page, the picture is there but it's missing the file itself.

The one at UKTS downloads ok.

Regards,

Stephen

Hi Stephen,

Thanks for letting me know. The link was not active. I have re-done it now, so please have another try and let me know if it works or not.

Geoff

Hi Geoff

The TSSH download link now works fine.

Where did you get the DMU_Class150 Cabview? I have searched all through my many trainset folders and the nearest I have is the 150Cab and even that doesn't have all the required .ace files. For simplicity I copied and renamed the 150Cab to DMU_150 but without these missing files I cannot get the full functionality of your otherwise excellent cabview.

This has the same problem in the UKTS download.

Is there any chance that you could add this either to the current download or as a separate download?

Regards,

Stephen

Hi Stephen,
Although they're not 3D, have you checked the ex-Making Tracks Class 150 cabview included in the re-issued Class 150 pack available from this site's library?

Cheers,
Ged

Hi Stephen,

I am a bit puzzled. What DMU_Class150 cabview are you referring to?

Geoff

By The way. When you get the cab working, keep an eye on the left hand phone cable, particularly under hard acceleration and braking.



Geoff

Hi Ged and Geoff,

Yes, I did check the ex-Making Tracks Class 150 cabview included in the re-issued Class 150 pack available from this site's library and it has the expected 150Cab.

Maybe I've got a bit confused, but I followed the instructions and copied
         
            ORTS3DCab(
ORTS3DCabFile ( "..\\..\\common.cab\\3D_Class317\\317_Cabview.s" )
ORTS3DCabHeadPos ( -0.9 2.55 8.55 )
RotationLimit ( 10 90 90 )
StartDirection (15 0 0 ) )

into the eng. file of  my chosen emu MT_DB_NSE_317311 and

Include ( AWS_eng.inc ) into the wagon section

3D_Class317 was added to the Common.Cab folder.

I then drove the full consist in Open Rails - fine.

Checking the Open Rails log file here is an extract:-

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\../../common.cab/dmu_class150/150_1throttle.ace replaced with default texture

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\../../common.cab/dmu_class150/150_1horn.ace replaced with default texture

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\../../common.cab/dmu_class150/150_1awsreset.ace replaced with default texture

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\aws.ace replaced with default texture

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\../../common.cab/dmu_class150/150_1aws.ace replaced with default texture

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\invcabcontrol.ace replaced with default texture

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\horn.ace replaced with default texture

Warning: Missing texture d:\great eastern mini route\train simulator\trains\trainset\mt_db_class317311_nse\cabview3d\default.ace replaced with default texture

What have I missed? or are all these warnings things that Open Rails expects to find but aren't needed? As far as I can see most of these are in the .cvf  of common.cab\\3D_Class317, if it wasn't needed then why was the .cvf file included?

Sorry if I'm being a pain in the proverbial,

Stephen

PS Geoff you wrote By The way. When you get the cab working, keep an eye on the left hand phone cable, particularly under hard acceleration and braking. I have noticed that it moves, is there a reason for this?

Hi Stephen,

Ok, now I understand.

Sorry about this. It's my fault. The cvf file is needed for the 3d cabview, but the textures in it are not relevant, and are not needed. I copied a cvf file of a 150 DMU as a basis, and therefore there are .ace files referenced which can't be found in your system. I can issue a better cvf file which will cure the problem, referencing an ace file that is findable. Meanwhile, if you want to try it yourself, you can edit the cvf file and change any reference to a graphic to be ( cab.ace ) and that will cure it.

for instance:
Dial (
Type ( SPEEDOMETER DIAL )
Position ( 305 340 6 15 )
Graphic ( Cab.ace )
Style ( NEEDLE )
ScaleRange ( 0 120 )
ScalePos ( 238.5 122.1 )
Units ( MILES_PER_HOUR )
Pivot ( 25 )
DirIncrease ( 0 )
)

It is a nuisance, but none of these graphic files are used at all in a 3d cab, but if the reference is not there, OR throws up an error. Similarly with the Position ( 305 340 6 15 ) lines and ScalePos.

The implementation of 3d cabs is not yet complete, I feel.
Thanks for reporting the problem.
Cheers,
Geoff

[quote="

PS Geoff you wrote By The way. When you get the cab working, keep an eye on the left hand phone cable, particularly under hard acceleration and braking. I have noticed that it  moves, is there a reason for this? [/quote]

It's just something I added for extra realism. The cable moves with acceleration and deceleration as it is free to act like a pendulum.

Another thing you may not appreciate or question is how there is a reflection of the AWS beacon in the internal glass window. Reflections on windows is not usually possible in Openrails or MSTS.

Just some modelling trickery.

Geoff

Hi Geoff,
I have just added the 317 3D cab to ex-MT Class 150 150001 and have many missing textures.  The reason appears to be because OR is looking for a folder named cabview3D in the stock folder; there's no mention of this in your instructions, neither is it included in the pack. The existing Class 150 has no 'normal' Cabview folder, using MT_Common,cabs instead.

Yes, I did spot the telephone cable gently swinging - very good, but I would have thought it should move a little more 'violently'.  Anyway, I appreciate this is just the beginning of something BIG!!

Cheers,
Ged

EDIT : Ahh! I've twigged that the 'cabview3D' is a default folder Open Rails looks for when it can't find a texture file!  How to overcome this?  It also seems to be looking for a folder in Common.cab named DMU_Class150, where on earth did it get that name from??  I created a folder with that name in the 'new' common.cab folder and added all the .ace files from the MT 150cab folder. Things did improve in that only 4 textures are now missing - aws.ace, default.ace, horn.ace and invcabcontrol.ace With respect, I have not yet tried a real Class 317 - my next job!

Hi Ged,

Please see my reply to Stephen previously.

The references to the Class150 come from the cvf file in the Cabview3d folder. A simple edit of the cvf file should eliminate all of the errors.
I will, however, upload a better cvf file that does not have these references in it.

Geoff

Hi Geoff,
Thanks, but there's no 'cabview3D' folder in my installation!  Is it a name generated by Open Rails?  If so, how can anyone, especially newcomers, know exactly what's missing?  It is shown as being a sub-folder of the stock folder.

Have now tried an MT Class 317 (from the Great Eastern route).  All is OK, except that the same 4 texture files are missing!!

Solved!  They are 'missing' because, in the .cvf file in the 3D_Class317 folder, they are not aliased, as are the other texture files, so are expected to be in the stock's own sub-folder.  Unfortunately, those files aren't in the 3D_Class317 folder, either, so aliasing won't help!

Cheers,
Ged

Not quite what you have been talking about, but is there a case for creating an "invisicab" for the first generation DMUs, and others which have driving trailers. It works well with the GWR autocoach, and one would be sufficient for each class rather than having to mess around with lots of separate items of rolling stock adding a drivable vehicle.
Jonathan

slipperman12 wrote:Hi Geoff,
Thanks, but there's no 'cabview3D' folder in my installation!  Is it a name generated by Open Rails?  If so, how can anyone, especially newcomers, know exactly what's missing?  It is shown as being a sub-folder of the stock folder.

Have now tried an MT Class 317 (from the Great Eastern route).  All is OK, except that the same 4 texture files are missing!!

Solved!  They are 'missing' because, in the .cvf file in the 3D_Class317 folder, they are not aliased, as are the other texture files, so are expected to be in the stock's own sub-folder.  Unfortunately, those files aren't in the 3D_Class317 folder, either, so aliasing won't help!

Cheers,
Ged

Hi Ged,

I am not too sure how it works, but it seems like OR does recognise the sub folder in the Common.cab folder as analogous to the Cabview3d folder that would otherwise reside in the locomotive folder in Trainset. You are right that all this aliasing of folders and files and "include" files does not make it easy to track down errors. On the other hand, it does cut down on having identical copies of the same Cabview 3d folder in many different locomotive folders. When you consider that this adds 17Mb each time it is used, it does make sense to try and use it.
I admit that I should try harder to make my uploads a bit tidier, and remove sources of error like missing file notifications in the log file; but in my defence, they don't always arise in my installation, and I tend to focus on whether the cab actually works or not. I guess I need to let others test the installation before uploading, but I am impatient.

Geoff

Hi Geoff,
I agree that the use of 'common.cab' folders reduces the need for multiple occurrences of the same sets of files, but it's been used successfully for many years by MSTS (sorry for using that 4-letter word in this Forum!!).. Having said that, similar messages would have been generated by Open Rails when detecting incorrectly-aliased or non-aliased texture files in common.cab folders in the original 2D system.

I also agree that the most important aspect is to get the cabviews working properly, but, with respect, that includes ensuring that no error messages occur when using them.  OK, so these are 'only' warning messages in OR but they should be avoided, if possible, because too many of them can be confusing.

I. too, get a little impatient sometimes, but when I'm happy with something I've created, I submit it to at least one other Community member for checking because I know how easy it is to miss something or take something for granted!

Cheers,
Ged

Hi Jonathan,

Not quite what you have been talking about, but is there a case for creating an "invisicab" for the first generation DMUs, and others which have driving trailers. It works well with the GWR autocoach, and one would be sufficient for each class rather than having to mess around with lots of separate items of rolling stock adding a drivable vehicle.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'invisicab'. If you're referring to the non-powered driving trailers, there has been discussion over at Elvastower regarding how Open Rails should treat or identify them.

Cheers,
Ged

I don't look at Elvas Tower. The suggestion is an invisible, zero length powered vehicle with a cabview which can be tacked on "outside" the driving trailer (which of course will not have a working cab) and provides a driving position for the unpowered driving trailer. This works for the GWR Autocoach. This is the content of the relevant Consist file:

SIMISA@@@@@@@@@@JINX0D0t______

Train (
TrainCfg ( GW_850PT+Auto
Serial ( 4 )
MaxVelocity ( 22.35200 0.63074 )
NextWagonUID ( 4 )
Durability ( 1.00000 )
Engine (
UiD ( 0 )
EngineData ( gwr850pt GWR850ST )
)
Wagon (
WagonData ( GWR_Auto_181 "BR and GWR autotrailers" )
UiD ( 3 )
)
Engine (
Flip ( )
UiD ( 2 )
EngineData ( InvisGWautoT InvisGWautoT )
)
)
)

The eng file for the actual invisible cab is attached as a Zip file. The whole folder is too big to attach (over 3 Mb).
I hope this is clear.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,

So this "invisicab" would be added on to the front of the DMU set to host the cabview. That would mean a different consist would be needed for each instance?

I guess it would work.

Geoff

Yes, you need to amend each Consist if you want to be able to drive the unit from the trailer end. But that is easy compared with trying to turn the trailer car into a "powered" vehicle with zero power., ie even I can manage it! The Consists will already exist; one simply adds the extra vehicle at the trailer end. Yes, it means changing one or two numbers in the consists as well as adding the extra vehicle if one does it by hand.
By the way there is already an LMS equivalent to the GWR one.
I have played around and I hope that the attached file will demonstrate the principle. I have not tested it but it is a direct amendment of the GWR autocoach version except that it has the advantage of using common cab and sound files.
I realise that the class 105 it not actually a good example as most of the units seem to have two powered cars, but it shows the principle, even though one is in fact a trailer.
I started this after finding a number of cases where it was not possible to switch to the cab in the other car, and I assumed that that was because it didn't have one. Perhaps I was wrong.
Jonathan

The download link for the Class 47 3d cab seems to be broken.

Thanks for letting me know. I have been talking to Justin and we are trying to find out why it will not download. Hopefully it will soon be fixed.

Geoff

Hi All!

It's all good to go now!

Jusitn

Thanks to the both of you, and also thank you for the wonderful cabs, they are true gems.

Thanks for the positive comments.

I am working on a model of HS4000 Falcon at the moment. It too will have a 3d cab. It may take a few months to finish though.

Geoff

Could you tell me a little about the AWS and how it works? I seem to have missed something. EDIT: Please diregard this post as i have found what i was looking for, i was using an older version of your 3d cab, now that i have the ccorrect version installed it works a charm. Thank you!

Sorry for more problems. I just converted all my EE Type 3's to the 3D cabs and it was really easy.

Just copy the txt from the instructions and insert in the respective eng files and delete 2d cab folder.

The Brush Type 4's are a whole new ball game. I just cannot get my head around, what i have to change and what i have to paste into each loco's eng file.

I am drowning in a sea of despair here boys.

Regards,
Mike.

The instructions for the Class 47 3d cab are a bit more complicated. This is because I decided to have the Cabview3d files in the Common.cab folder, instead of having them added to each Class 47 locomotive separately. After all, you may have a fleet of Locomotives, and adding the files to each one takes up a bit of space.

So that is where the complications come in. Having said that, it should all work out if you can follow the instructions. The first thing to do is to find the folders in the download called common.cab and common.crew. Copy each of these and paste them into your TRAINSET folder in your installation. This will add the relevant files in the common folders, that can then be called up to be used by any locomotive by a command in the .eng file.

Next step is to select a Class 47 that you want to add the 3d cab into, and find the folder for it in the TRAINSET folder. Then copy the 3 folders in the download called Openrails, Script and SOUND, and paste them into your chosen locomotive folder.

Then you need to edit the .eng file that will be found in the Openrails folder that you just pasted in to your chosen loco folder. The installation instructions show the lines that need to be edited. The idea here is that the .eng file that is residing in the openrails folder, will be used in preference to the original .eng file that is in your loco folder. So it needs to have the right name in it. That is the name of the loco that you have chosen which will be the same as the one in the original .eng file. Once you have edited it, save it as a new file in the openrails folder, with the same name as your original .eng file.

I hope that makes more sense.

Cheers, Geoff

Sorry Geoff, completely my fault. I just read your post twice and then it dawned on me, i have to use the substitute eng file you provided.

What stumped me was, i couldn't understand where in the original eng file, i had to paste in all the new stuff from your instructions txt.

In the similar way that i did with the EE Type 3's.

What a complete idiot i am. Sorry for bothering you again.

I was running with the EE Type 3 with 3D cab, on MEP. What a difference it makes to the immersion factor, like chalk and cheese compared to 2d.

Could really do with two 3D variants for the modernisation plan dmu's, pretty please

Regards,
Mike.

Worked first time thank you Geoff. But, there is always a but with me.

I have 3 boys in the cab, so obviously i have messed up somewhere  

Please click on pics, as the forum does not seem to support widescreen format screenies.





Regards,
Mike.

Hi Mike,

You haven't messed up. That particular loco must have a crew attached already, and the driver I added is making it a bit crowded.

There are two possibilities. Either the crew are part of the loco model, in which case, you can't get rid of them; or they are added using a Freight Animation in the .eng file. If it is the latter, you should be able to find the line in the .eng file and delete them.

The other option is to delete the Freight Animation in the .eng file that calls up "Driver Joe". That will leave the original crew.

These are the lines to delete:
FreightAnimStatic
(
SubType(Default)
Shape( "..\\common.crew\\Animated\\Driver_joe.s")
Offset( -0.8 2.1 -8.4 )
FreightWeight(0.01t)
Flip()
Visibility ( "Outside,Cab2D" )
)

Or you can leave them all and pretend it is driver training.

Geoff

Hahahahahahaha, driver training, like it.

Thanks very much again for replying and your patience, Geoff.

I would prefer to keep your driver\secondman, so i will have a look at the original eng file.

To see if it has a freight.anim entry.

Many thanks.

Regards,
Mike.