Windows 10 problem

I have just bought a new high-end HP laptop running Windows 10, as my existing machine is giving up the ghost - keys and USB ports not working properly.
But when I try to start MSTS using the "train" exe file it starts and then collapses after a couple of seconds.
The only significant change is that the files are in a D drive rather than the C drive which is reserved for programs.
Any suggestions?
By the way Open Rails runs fine, though there is issues with the way the laptop allocates functions to the function keys which took a bit of sorting.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
First question : does your PC use an AMD graphics 'card'? If so, please ignore the remainder of this message, and come back.

Second question, by "and then collapses" do you mean that it closes?
If so, have you set train.exe to run as administrator? This important point is missing from the otherwise excellent Steam4Me tutorial!
Right-click train.exe and select Properties, press the Compatibility tab and make sure there's a tick in the "Run this program as an administrator" box. No other compatibility options should be required.
If you've already done the above, there is one other situation where MSTS will refuse to run, and, as far as I know there is no work-around. That is if your PC has a super high resolution monitor (greater than 1920x1080).

Cheers,
Ged

No it is not a AMD graphics card. I was aware of that problem from the past.
And the screen resolution is 1920 x 1080, so that should not be the problem.
I have tried changing the properties of run as administrator but it makes no difference.
By "collapse" I meant that the screen goes black as though Trainsim is loading and then after about two seconds it returns to the desktop.
My setup has numerous MSTS folders with groups of routes - eg Australian, so that there are not too many consists and it is possible to find the rolling stock required. I used to use Trainstore but abandoned it some years ago. I have tried several "train.exe " files bot to no avail. I also moved my basic MSTS setup into the C drive but that made no difference.
Incidentally, I am also having trouble with Route Riter first not finding Java - which is installed - and then saying that it can't find the folder. I can create consists but cannot do any checking.
Is it perhaps a matter in some cases of registry entries, as everything was simply copied over from the old laptop?
Just for luck I have forgotten the login for TSSH, so have not yet managed to access it on the new laptop - hence this message is being sent from my old one. I have tried both the possible e-mail addresses to get a new one and it rejects both of them! But that is for another day.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
About TSSH log-in - have you tried "I've lost my password"?  I think it will send an email to the address you used to register.  Edit - See below

MSTS will run without Registry entries, but anything you enter in the OPTIONS screen will not be saved.  When you copied your  MSTS installation/s to your new PC, you did copy each installation's root folder, didn't you?  If not, you'd probably be short of the GLOBAL folder and its contents, including tsection.dat, without which MSTS won't start.

Route_Riter.  Have you copied the contents of  the Route_Riter/TSUtils folder into a new folder called 'classes' in the Java/jre1.8.0_191 folder (or whatever yours is called)?  R_R does need to be able to find an MSTS Registry entry.

Cheers,
Ged

EDIT : If you can access the PM system, I've sent you a message containing your registered email address!

Did you install MSTS from scratch on your new computer, following the Steam4Me tutorial? After that, installations copied across will work, but without it they won't. I use the same idea as you rather than trainstore, but I have fresh basic installation from the CDs with MSTS Bin added.

Good luck,

Roderic

Many thanks to both of you.
Login problem solved. senior moment about the log-in name!
I didn't follow the procedure in the SteamforMe tutorial, I did what I did when I got the last laptop, but perhaps things have changed in three or four years.
I'll read the instructions now!
By the way, I mentioned that on the new laptop the function keys act oddly. It appears that in their wisdom HP have allocated functions to most of F1 to F10 which over-ride the Open Rails commands. However, if the first time after one starts an activity one uses the Fn key plus say F4 then after that the OR commands work. Very odd, and it took a bit of finding out.
I have yet to try to sort out Route Riter but thanks for the pointer.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
Glad you've got your log-in sorted

No, things haven't changed in the last few years regarding installing MSTS - Win 7 has been around since 2009!

Going back a long time, I remember having a laptop with pre-allocated Function Keys, but they could be reverted to 'normal' by pressing another key.  It may well have been Fn, but I can't remember - it's age, you know!!

Cheers,
Ged

There must be something peculiar about the laptop configuration.
I have reinstalled MSTS from the disks - having bought a new external disk drive for the purpose - but it won't run. As before it starts, the screen goes black, There seems to be a change of screen resolution and then it returns to the desktop at the original screen resolution. Also MSTS_Swap does not see it.
I didn't follow the Steam4Me tutorial completely partly because TweakUAC seems to have disappeared and it is one program for which I didn't keep the original download. And I haven't yet installed the Microsoft official update.
I can run everything in Open Rails but of course I cannot write or edit activities.
I have got Route Riter working.
Fortunately i still have the old laptop wioth all the MSTS setup on it so can use it for editing activites and then copy them over.
I now need to investigate those standard engines for Open Rails to see if they make it possible to run steam era activities realistically.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
What does MSTS_Swap report?

You shouldn't need TweakUAC - I've not used it for years! - it might not even work with Win 10. If you didn't follow the Steam4Me tutorial completely, which part/s did you omit? One important point missing from that excellent tutorial is that train.exe and launcher.exe MUST be set to 'run as administrator'. Right-click each .exe file, select 'Properties' then make sure there's a tick in the 'Run this program as an administrator' box. Without it, MSTS will not start!! No other compatibility settings are required.

I wouldn't recommend running MSTS from an external drive (assuming USB connection) as it could be too slow, and MSTS won't accept being held up!!

Cheers,
Ged

I had set the both exe files to run as administrator and had renamed the uninstall file. The 1MSTS folder is set to read/write. I have not done the official update or things like screen resolution, extra memory, the various fixes etc as there seemed little point until the basic MSTS was working. I already have the various extras such as Xtracks waiting to be installed, though they are already in the backup copy of MSTS from the old laptop.
I have now explored and found the programs in the "All files" list - which of course is now completely different from that in Windows 7. Having added the Editors and Tools icon to the start bar this now works - though the same operation with the train.exe file didn't work. The icon is there in the start bar but the program doesn't load. And the MSTS Editor doesn't show up in MSTS_Swap - neither does the MSTS train.exe file.
I shall try uninstalling and reinstalling MSTS)_Swap to see if it now recognised the MSTS Editor file. If it doe that will be a useful step.
Many thanks for your patience.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
There is NO separate .exe file for the Editors & Tools - train.exe (or launcher.exe) runs both the sim and Editors & Tools depending on the parameters given. For this reason, the Editors won't show up in MSTS_Swap - please post a screenshot of its first screen

If you are going to run the MSTS sim (ie not just running the MSTS data in Open Rails), I recommend that you DO NOT use launcher.exe.  This is because most of the useful parameters cannot be used (eg the Mem switch).  For this reason, do not use the Start Menu entries as they only use launcher.exe.

A. To create a Desktop icon to run the MSTS sim :
1. Locate file train.exe and right-click it, then left-click 'Send to..' and left-click 'Desktop (create shortcut)'.  
2. Find the shortcut on your Desktop - it will be labelled 'train.exe - shortcut' - and..
3. ..rename it to something more descriptive (eg MSTS).  
4. Right-click the Desktop icon and left-click 'Properties';  the end of the 'Target: ' line entry will be either train.exe or train.exe".  
5. To add the Mem switch, following .exe or .exe", add one space then -mem:2048
6. Press the 'Apply' and 'OK' buttons

B. To create a Desktop icon to run the Editors & Tools :
1. As A 1.
2. As A 2.
3.  ..rename it as, something like, MSTS Editors
4. As A 4.
5. Following the .exe or .exe", add one space followed by -toolset -mem:2048 (note the one space between toolset and -mem)
6. As A 6.

Obviously, at 3., you can rename the Desktop icon to whatever is most appropriate; for example, my MidEast Plus Editors shortcut is named MEP Editors.

I hope this helps!  I seem to have written the above many times before but wasn't able to find it to provide a link!!

Cheers,
Ged

Done exactly as you wrote - and as in the Steam4Me tutorial - but no difference.
I think that I shall take a rest from this and look at getting realistic steam locomotive operation in Open Rails. There have been some recent useful uploads.
For the moment I can use the installation on my old laptop to create activities etc and then copy them over, though it is now very, very slow.
I have some Open Rails oddities which I may ask about some time, but I have a life outside MSTS and it is calling!
Many thanks for your help and patience.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
As you please, but whatever problem you have now will still be there when/if you return to MSTS!! It'd be better to get it sorted

Also, you didn't post a screenshot of the MSTS_Swap screen as I requested - it might have helped solve your problem.

Cheers,
Ged

Re MSTS_Swap, I needed to download and install the latest version which I have now done.
Screen grab attached. No change from v1.4 previously installed. It is not finding the MSTS installation.
Jonathan
One thought. I did not register MSTS when I installed it on this laptop. I wouldn't have thought that was relevant nearly 20 years on, though I am sure I registered it first time around.

Hi Jonathan,
Thank you.
There is no Registry entry for MSTS!  MSTS_Swap has created a skeleton entry for its own use and so that other utilities, called from MSTS_Swap, will run correctly.

For MSTS, and many other associated utilities, to run correctly, you must install MSTS properly - ie from its CDs  You might think it's irrelevant after 20 years, but the program hasn't changed so still has its original requirements.

Cheers,
Ged

I did install it from the CDs. I had to buy an external DVD reader to do it. I can try again. Certainly it made heavy weather of disk 2, at least the first part of the transfer. I'll try registering it too.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
I have no idea what you mean by "registering it"!!  MSTS is either installed, or it isn't; if CD2 didn't complete, then it's not installed.

Many users have problems with CD2, especially with Win 10!  I suggest you try to copy the contents of both CDs into the same temporary folder on your hard drive - do not allow the one duplicate file to overwrite.  When done, run setup.exe, as administrator, from your temporary folder to install MSTS - it'll be appreciably quicker than from the CDs!

If you now get MSTS correctly installed, save the temporary folder somewhere safe, just in case you need to re-install MSTS.

Cheers,
Ged

Thanks for bearing with me. I am extremely grateful.
By registering I meant on the Microsoft website - however, the relevant page no longer exists, and neither could I find the update file. Just as well I have it safely tucked away.
I tried copying all the files onto two folders on the hard disk and then combining them in one folder before in stalling the game, and it seemed to go OK except that when I then tried to install I got the following message after about 29% - ie the switch to the second disk -
"Failed to verify media. Installation cancelled"
I therefore tried again to copy the files from the CDs onto the hard disk. Very interesting. for both disks it showed some files which still needed copying over even though a check showed that they were already copied - why I don't know - it concerned 116 files on disk 1 and 11 on disk 2. total files on the two disks 3793 on disk 1 and 375 on disk 2.
I also tried installing as administrator but with the same result.
My initial assumption was that some files were not copying over successfully from disk 2 which for some reason takes ages to copy with a great deal of noise. However, that does not seem to be the case.
One other comment. At no time when copying disk 2 was I asked about overwriting a file which was on disk 1. Do you know the name of the file which should have been flagged up?
Anyway, this will now be taking a back seat because I have about 100 photos to scan and then a book to lay out for the HMRS - Southern Style - Southern Railway by John Harvey, hopefully for publication early next year.
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,
At no time when copying disk 2 was I asked about overwriting a file which was on disk 1
You wouldn't if you copied the CDs to separate folders, but you should have seen the message when combining the two folders into one!
However, I have come across a different problem ...

As you probably know, before I give an answer to any query, I check it out personally to ensure that whatever I'm about to suggest, actually works

I performed the same procedures as you, copying the CDs to individual folders, then combining them into one folder, but when I tried to run setup.exe, received this message :

Rebooting didn't help and running setup.exe as administrator made no difference.  Running setup.exe from a similar folder, into which I'd copied the CDs many moons ago, and which I'd used previously to successfully set up MSTS, gave the same message!!  This was using Windows 10 Pro 64-bit v1809, updated to July 2019.

Reverting to Windows 7, the same message was given when attempting to install from a hard drive.  Using the actual CD1, the message was NOT displayed.
This makes me think that it may be some recently introduced incompatibility in my PC (dual-boot into Win 7 & Win 10), but until I have solved this problem, I'm not able to offer any help to you.  Sorry  

Cheers,
Ged

Hi Jonathan,
If you're still listening/watching ...

The problems I reported in my last post are nothing to do with Windows Update (7 or 10)!  On one hand, this is good news but, on the other, it's bad news because I don't know what is causing them!!

Using my backup PC, which hadn't been updated since Jan 2019, I applied the Win 7 updates, one by one and tested Setup.exe (in files/folders copied from CD1 to hard drive folder) after each update.  At no time were any errors reported.  Win 10 doesn't allow the updates to be selected, but after all had been applied, Setup.exe ran successfully.  

Reverting to my main PC, the error message only occurs when running Setup.exe from a hard drive folder into which the CD (or CDs) contents had been copied.  Inexplicably, if a .iso file is created from that same hard drive folder and 'mounted', Setup.exe can be run without any problem!!

Still working on it ....

Cheers,
Ged

Hi,
I'm pretty certain that I've found the cause of the error message I encountered when attempting to run Setup.exe from a hard drive copy of the MSTS CD1 folders and files. It was nothing peculiar to my PC and could apply to any user!

Simply, if the path to setup.exe contains any spaces, the error will be reported. If you have this problem, and it's impracticable to rename any folders, or move the MSTS folder elsewhere, creating a .iso file, using FoldertoIso is a viable work-around.

Even though the path to a .iso file may contain spaces, the action of 'mounting' it (using a program like WinCDEmu) creates a new drive with the actual files in its root, so no folder names are used. The name of the .iso file may contain spaces without causing any problem.

Both the programs mentioned are small, free, safe and very useful :
FoldertoIso - convert the contents of a folder into a .iso file - www.trustfm.net/software/utilities/Folder2Iso.php
WinCDEmu - Mount a .iso file as a separate drive, so that it acts like a fast CD/DVD - https://wincdemu.sysprogs.org/

Cheers,
Ged